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Poll

Votes: 17

Controversy...

Author:

ana

Topic:

Diaries

Posted:

Nov 26, 2001

Comments:

A controversial (or perhaps trivially obvious) question for the nexus of controversy in the modern world.

More diaries by ana

	It's all broken
	Mmmkay...
	Musings
	Haloween party
	fill-in-the-blank smut
	Oh, my...

So since there's a strong Christian prescence here, and a love of controversy, will somebody answer me this (seriously)? [Doh! Silly me, asking serious questions here!]

How is the transition from shy, retiring, damned-if-i-let-you-touch-me virgin to adult sexual human being supposed to go? Speaking for the both of us who picked catholic morality. If it makes any difference I'm middle-aged already and still can't figger it out.

	Middle aged? (none / 0) (#1)
	by osm on Mon Nov 26th, 2001 at 12:27:28 PM PST

	You mean you're 23? I never would have guessed.

	Well... (none / 0) (#13)
	by ana on Tue Nov 27th, 2001 at 07:32:47 AM PST

	aged then. Why not?

	Catholic Morality (5.00 / 1) (#2)
	by Anonymous Reader on Mon Nov 26th, 2001 at 12:39:20 PM PST

	From what I've figured out, that transition is supposed to take place in a large elaborate ceremony, involving frilly dresses, legal proceedings, a Mass, and ending with a big party. I've been to a few. Such a transition is truly a big deal.

	Yeah, but (none / 0) (#3)
	by ana on Mon Nov 26th, 2001 at 12:57:20 PM PST

	...these things involve consent, and how's a good Catholic girl supposed to recognize that in herself when she sees it? Why not?

	easy (none / 0) (#5)
	by Anonymous Reader on Mon Nov 26th, 2001 at 01:47:54 PM PST

	it happens about the time when your feelings for someone else become selfless, when you love without demanding love in return, when it doesnt matter if the person in your bed is redhead with a fabulous figure or an Afghan girl with a smudged face and amputated leg. Oh, wait, I might be thinking of childbirth.

	straw man (5.00 / 2) (#6)
	by nathan on Mon Nov 26th, 2001 at 03:59:55 PM PST

	Please don't conflate Catholicism with Christianity. One is a set of cultural practices based upon a religion; the other one is a religion. The Christian religion is a philosophical idea, and in no way binds you to frigid virginity. The idea that a spouse should enter the marriage a virgin is itself commendable, but Catholic practice tends to make sex dirty in general, from what I hear; thus, the well-known whore/saint split in the mentality of the archetypical "good Catholic girl." Christianity, as a philosophy, does not make decisions of policy. Catholicism, as a politico-religious institution existing in the world, must. It is our bad luck that, in attempting to prevent extramarital sex through institutional coercion, the Catholic church has instituted a few new perversions - such as the well known cult of frigid virginity. But I'm drifting from the point. The distinction between Christian ideology and Catholic practice must be made, because Catholicism (while a movement rooted in Christianity) must perforce attach itself to questions of policy and conformity. Thus, attacking Christianity in the name of the frigid virginity taught by some (degenerate) forms of Catholicism is to attack it for its connection with something with which it is in no way responsible. Nathan -- Li'l Sis: Yo, that's a real grey area. Even by my lax standards.

	No attack was intended (none / 0) (#12)
	by ana on Tue Nov 27th, 2001 at 06:49:52 AM PST

	Indeed, I find Catholic thought on things like physical vs. spiritual life interesting and refreshing (unlike the stereotype "Catholic School" image). But somehow in the voluminous pile of writings on the general subject, I've yet to find myself: Christian, middle-aged, celibate (all more or less independent facts of life), and wondering what's missing in my personality. Oh, and, of course, writer of fantasy smut. Ana Why not?

	From what I hear, it goes something like this: (none / 0) (#7)
	by Anonymous Reader on Mon Nov 26th, 2001 at 11:08:06 PM PST

	1. Fear 2. Tentative steps into the world 3. Discovery 4. Pleasure 5. Joy 6. Betrayal 7. Humiliation 8. Pain 9. Bottomless, soul-searing agony 10. Nothingness, numbness, all is ashes 11. Withdrawal. 12. Security 13. Boredom 14. Desire, ambition, curiosity 15. Uncertainty 16. Fear Repeat steps 1-16 until you grow old and die. Game over. Hope this helps.

	Hey osm... (none / 0) (#8)
	by RobotSlave on Mon Nov 26th, 2001 at 11:17:59 PM PST

	Are you posting anonymously because you don't want to be caught ripping off Life In Hell, or did you just forget your password again? © 2002, RobotSlave. You may not reproduce this material, in whole or in part, without written permission of the owner.

	I'm not osm, I'm that other reclusive misanthrope (none / 0) (#9)
	by Anonymous Reader on Mon Nov 26th, 2001 at 11:26:59 PM PST

	Ripping off Life In Hell?!?! Fuck, why don't you just compare me to the unholy spawn of Charles Manson and Tonya Harding while you're at it? Jerk.

	Clarification (none / 0) (#10)
	by Anonymous Reader on Tue Nov 27th, 2001 at 01:18:39 AM PST

	Note that my revulsion in the above message is a result of my having been compared to Matt Groening, and not having at been mistaken for osm, who, thanks to his having shared this with the rest of us, I esteem higher than the guy who refills my nitrous oxide tank. RobotSlave, you still suck dognipples.

	And you, dear friend, are still anonymous. (none / 0) (#11)
	by RobotSlave on Tue Nov 27th, 2001 at 02:38:54 AM PST

	I, too, would hide my identity if I were reduced to imitating Groening, and then further reduced to goatse.cx linking when caught. This is Adequacy. The run-of-the-mill shitting dicknipple linkage that knocks over easy prey in the amateur leagues just doesn't cut it at this premiere world-net address. If you want to fling effective invective around here, you're going to have to do it the old fashioned way; determine my psychological wounds and weaknesses, and then exploit them in a campaign of original, lucid, and devastating insults. Incidentally, it might help you to learn how to use words like "esteem" gracefully, while you're at it. Facility with language is valued here, in marked contrast to the cavalier, ignorant attitude promulgated at other sites. © 2002, RobotSlave. You may not reproduce this material, in whole or in part, without written permission of the owner.

	"Esteem" is a verb (none / 0) (#16)
	by Anonymous Reader on Tue Nov 27th, 2001 at 08:54:06 AM PST

	See? You mean this isn't Matt Groening? It looks just like him. "You suck dognipples" was supposed to exploit your psychological wounds and weaknesses. Oh well, I will try harder next time. Thanks for the tip.

	Dictionary? (none / 0) (#17)
	by RobotSlave on Tue Nov 27th, 2001 at 09:44:24 AM PST

	You think you can beat me up with a dictionary? This might take longer than I thought. Ooh, you got the part of speech right! What a wizard you are! It was not a grammatical flaw, sir, but rather the particularly clumsy deployment of a word that revealed you as a posturing, unread lout. You must be a computer-operator by trade. Strict adherence to all posted rules while willfully ignoring any question of grace or aesthetics seems to be endemic to that profession. Now go make up an insult that doesn't begin with the words "you suck," imbecile. © 2002, RobotSlave. You may not reproduce this material, in whole or in part, without written permission of the owner.

	Generally, you meet a guy (5.00 / 1) (#14)
	by Adam Rightmann on Tue Nov 27th, 2001 at 08:08:52 AM PST

	How is the transition from shy, retiring, damned-if-i-let-you-touch-me virgin to adult sexual human being supposed to go? Speaking for the both of us who picked catholic morality. If it makes any difference I'm middle-aged already and still can't figger it out. Generally, you meet a guy, through your parish, or pehaps on the internet, and decide that you enjoy his company, and also a part of you feels physically attracted to him. This is scary, because said guy may not have reciprocal feelings, but like diving off the high diving board, you just have to do it, express your interest. Remember, faint heart ne'er won fair man. If the interest is returned, you proceed to displays of physical affection, then engagement, then posting banns, then getting married, then sex. If the interest is not returned, it's back to square one, looking for another compatible guy. All in all, a very daunting task, opening up oneself to damage one's self esteem, particularly after being rejected deeper and deeper into the cycle, as increasing physical intimacy leads to increasing emotional intimacy, and repeated failed relationships can lead to damaged emotional growth. So, no magic bullet, just lots of potential for hurt, but the rewards are great. A. Rightmann

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